How to Handle, Yes, Body Odor - Part 1

Thank you! With summer on its way this

Thank you!
With summer on its way this topic is even more significant.

I enjoyed your podcast regarding this

I enjoyed your podcast regarding this delicate topic and had to smile a few times because this was all too familiar to me.

I recently had a very similar situation and I had to deal with it. (I sure wish I had heard this first. It would have saved me a lot of time and anguish!) As it turned out, I would get very congested whenever I was in this lady's presence. We all work in close quarters, so it was a difficult situation that needed a remedy.... soon... and all my team was looking to me for an answer!

One day, when I was having a sneezing fit and I was all watery-eyed and congested (and hamming it up a bit), the moment I had been setting up occurred and she made the statement, "My goodness, you seem to be allergic to me!" Those words were music to my ears and the moment I was waiting for to tell her that I doubted that I was allergic to HER, but curious as to whether or not she wore perfume or cologne or some lotion because I am sensitive so some fragrances that I can't always detect. I told her how some fragrances even give me headaches! (That is true.) She was thrilled to tell me that she DID (and that it was expensive) but that perhaps she shouldn't wear it to work anymore since it had such an affect on me! She was actually relieved to know she could save her perfume for special occasions and not wear it to work... making it last longer! It was the only way I knew I could approach it without causing a truly awkward situation and it worked for all of us! I even thanked her for her consideration in her decision not to wear it anymore.

I was actually able to empower her into making the right decision and there wasn't a moment when anyone felt uncomfortable or embarrassed.

A classic story! Glad it went so

A classic story! Glad it went so well.

Mark

Can I give you guys some feedback?

Can I give you guys some feedback? When you produce content on this kind of subject when there are so many more important areas to focus on........you make me believe that your premium casts are close to rolling out and you will save the important topics for those who pay$$ and provide silly ones (like how to handle body odor) for free. You make me question your selection of topics and quality of the casts......

From a loyal listener, this was pretty far out there. Yes it is an issue and it could be a problem but don't you think it represents a very, very small sliver of issues that manager face? Now, if this was a "filler" cast, no problem. Just say so. But 2 parts????? Every Sunday night I wait for your next cast and now I have to wait for body odor part 2? A rare miss.

Blueman- Thanks for the input.

Blueman-

Thanks for the input. Sorry you think it's silly. To answer your question, we actually get asked this question a lot - as we mentioned in the intro - so, no, it's not necessarily a small sliver. Sorry you felt it was.

It saddens us that a "rare miss" causes you to discount two years of free material and question our integrity and ethics. You mightn't ought to listen to people whom you believe are capable of such chicanery. I wouldn't.

Cheers!

Mark

This brings to mind other "third rail"

This brings to mind other "third rail" issues of handling opposite-gender matters. For instance the female manager who is getting complaints from team members about a male subordinate who frequently readjusts his trousers. Or the male manager getting complaints that a female is wearing clothes that are too revealing or, worse yet, is allagedly not wearing a bra. The complainer usually claims to be offended that their co-worker is meeting customers and giving the wrong impression of the office or team. Ignoring the situation seems to be out of the question.

The presumption is that any attempt to bring up the subject will be met with "why are you looking?" and risk having the employee counter by a claim of sexual harassment.

Faced with any such situation, as a male I've asked a female peer to talk to the employee, but is there a better way?

I am so glad where this topic went. I

I am so glad where this topic went. I was a bit nervous as it began. We have had a number of issues that came up because of the multi-cultural nature of our business. Not just scent, but scent has always been a sticky point. And not just personal scent, but food as well during lunch time. It seems that Americans have been marketed effectively to a very intolerant expectation of people's scent. Some of the compllaints I have received, actually included the pitch line from some advertisements, "Just a sprinkle a day..."

I think the approach you gentlemen have offerde would have been great, especially focusing on impact.

What I used to do, would be to talk to complainers about what scent is really about in nature. Talking about how it is used to identify things about ourselves, and familiarity. So of course your scent would clearly indicate that you were apart of your environment and be shared by others in your environment. And we only spend 10 hours a day together, so someone is much more likely to develop their scent around what works in their personal life and at home.

I used this approach both to try and convince some to be more tolerant (maybe reducing the perceived impact) and occasionally to others to think about what they might be communicating to others with their scent if it was not what might be more common (this approach always created a pit in my stomach). I don't think I was particularly effective, but the complaining stopped. But I have always thought that was just because my team didn't want to endure another boring lecture about the history of scent.

This has turned out to be a very interesting cast and I do think it has a 'meta' application as Mike indicated.

Thanks,
-Sly

Sly- We agree with you. We didn't

Sly-

We agree with you. We didn't talk a lot about managing expectations - it's quite hard and if you start with the wrong person it can be demoralizing.

Hopefully if it does happen again you will have better results.

Glad you're with us!

Mark

Don- GREAT point. We do see these

Don-

GREAT point. We do see these as being slightly different, but the concept is the same.

We don't think managers should shy away from giving feedback to those of the opposite gender, lawyers notwithstanding.

Mark

Don, I think a manager in that

Don, I think a manager in that situation should always stick to the specifics. If the feedback is taken wrongly that is a matter for future discussion. Finish the feedback on that particular item. Careful and ultra conservative use of language assists as does careful selection of meeting enirvonment.

If a worker alleges sexual intent then obvious immediate apology for any offence. However, restated need for action on specifics and invite complainee to separate meeting to deal with any grievance - and take back up to that meeting.

Chris

No questioning of your integrity or

No questioning of your integrity or ethics. We are all good - obviously several other people share this concern. Now that I said I didn't need this cast, I am sure Murphy will visit and I will have to deal. Keep it up!

Blueman- Glad you're still

Blueman-

Glad you're still here!

Mark

Blueman I admit I was quite

Blueman

I admit I was quite surprised at your original comments. Then I was able to take a step back and say to myself "Self, Blue is entitled to both enjoy or not enjoy and feel this is valuable or not valuable."

That being said, I think you brought something interesting to the table. We are all at different places on the management spectrum and growing at different speeds. Thus, we all need different tools and lessons at different times in our careers, as will our directs.

Thanks for this reminder of keeping perspective - what is important to me might not be important to you right now. It will help us all be better managers.

*RNTT

I was not very excited about the

I was not very excited about the subject, too. And not excited to learn there is a second part ! It will not be very usefull for me as French people all smell so good (sorry this is "humour" ... Yes, I know it's bad)

But again, what I enjoyed is THE WAY Mark and Mike manage the subject. This is what I like in MT : analyse impact, and not reasons. Influence behaviour, not personnality. All of this can be used for other cases ...

I really like how much they respect people.

This sense of respect itself should have clearly shown to Blueman they could not be accused to have this kind of ideas ! Impossible ...

Céd.

Sensitive topic, but clearly one that

Sensitive topic, but clearly one that is so often brutally done poorly. Mike & Mark, I applaud you for this 'cast (and I've only listened to one-half). There are people throughout the company I work for that have struggled with this issue. It's been many years since I have had this issue but find the steps so far to be wonderfully useful. Thanks again for touching on this delicate matter.

Thanks Dave! We get the question far

Thanks Dave! We get the question far more than we'd like, and it will only happen more as our cultures and habits and personal norms rub up against one another.

Mark

Blueman, you didn't provide feedback,

Blueman, you didn't provide feedback, all you did was insult two individuals who have gone out of their way to provide management advice to a worldwide audience over an extended period of time for FREE, and without advertising. MT advice is relevant, timely, and on the mark and the value of this advice would be measured in thousands of dollars. Mark and Mike's efforts are outstanding and quite unbelievable and they are deserving of the highest plaudits, not cheap shots disquised as "feedback".

since my Powerbook crashed I've had to

since my Powerbook crashed I've had to run to the library, but man this is a must listen.

since high school I'm that 'Pig Pen' kid, but my problem is whenever I smell anything 'weird' I'm off to find a corner or closet and begin the self-inspection. Now as an adult it's decreased or my sense of smell has, but something in deodorants/anti-perspirants just clash with my body chemistry.

srinking a glass of baking soda/water mix or San Pellegrino is the only thing that works a bit better. Can't wait to hear the show.