Why We Do This
March 10th, 2008Two things happened today that I have conflated to remind me of why we’re here.
First, we got our first confessional email from a member who admitted to paying for premium content, downloading it all, and then unsubscribing.
Second, I re-read a column discussing how work is no longer fulfilling for knowledge workers because they don’t produce measurable/visible/knowable output. One guy said that because he resells energy futures, he envies electricians the fact that they can see their accomplishments, which may last a long time.
But then a management consultant said that she envied her clients celebrating a clear accomplishment, and, “‘That must be a tremendous feeling […]one I will never know.’”
While I generally don’t like to define things in terms of negatives, these two items reminded me why Manager Tools exists.
First, Mike and I do spend time talking about how to protect our work, and we do try to be careful. We have a great IP lawyer. And, we generally refuse to work on protecting our stuff when it gets technically complicated OR when we think our best users are going to stumble over the protections. I am SURE that our biases here made it easy for the confessor to do so.
We’re sticking to our plan.
Some people are going to steal Manager Tools’ stuff. We think it’s wrong and reprehensible. We think our honor system rightly mirrors the honor system of managers. If you work for us, we’ll forgive you for cheating…and we will fire you. We believe in redemption AND trustworthiness.
But we’re not going to make it hard for the vast majority of folks to grow and develop because of a few who don’t share our view of honor.
Thanks to all of you, we can’t imagine not feeling a sense of accomplishment. We feel accomplishments every day, all the time! We love getting notes about how you’re doing and how we played a role. (And yes, we still think YOU deserve all the credit).
As we grow, we get more notes thanking us every day. I read each one multiple times. On bad days, I re-read many of them.
We want everyone to get better as managers, so much so we know we’re going to get cheated. And we know it’s working, because we feel it every day.
We would do this for free.
For you.
That’s why we do this.
For you.
Stumble it!Trackback URL for this post: http://www.manager-tools.com/2008/03/why-we-do-this/trackback/
March 10th, 2008 at 2:23 pm
Great thoughts, and thanks for all you do. For us.
I’m sure most of your subscribers can relate to your sentiments… There is a little quixotic martyr in every good (read non-A.H.) manager.
March 10th, 2008 at 3:25 pm
Guys,
This journey that you (and now I) are on regarding making the WORLD a better managed place is a noble one. There will always be people who will figure out a way to game the system and try and take something for nothing. That should not be your concern!!! Your user community and the KARMA(IC) SP?? wheel will take care of them!!!
Be happy and proud that you are able to influence so many people positively AND make a living (or attempt to LOL) at it as well!!
March 10th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
Mark, I’m a premium user who’s sort of the opposite of the person you described above! I purchased the premium content, but rarely download the printed materials. Sometimes I do, but not as often as I thought I would. The main reason I purchased was to support you guys.
March 10th, 2008 at 3:43 pm
Richard and Brian-
We love you guys.
Thanks.
Mark
March 10th, 2008 at 4:57 pm
Mike and Mark,
Thank you both for all you do. I am an aspiring manager and am a proud premium content provider. I was recently laid off in January and only wish I had finished listening to your interview and prepare to be laid off podcasts fully (and prepared myself) prior to this.
Since that time I have gone back to almost every podcast and re-listened and taken your words to heart. I have “turned off that damned tv” as was stated in one podcast and subscribed to the Wall Street Journal. I wish I had kept better records of contacts and completely agree about when you leave, you get cut off from access of contacts. I have seen my interview skills increase thanks to your tips, I have learned to follow up with interviews and was finally able to “close” an interview last Friday and loved the looks on the interviewer’s faces. I look forward to new podcasts every week and even those that do not relate to me directly right now are wonderful to listen to and learn from. Keep up the wonderful work !!!! My only question to you and other readers is how do you keep track of contacts, do you use Outlook or do you use another program. I would love to hear what others do. I hope everyone has a wonderful week.
Bryan
California
March 10th, 2008 at 5:14 pm
I wouldn’t worry about the person that d/l the podcasts since his moral character will not find any value in what he hears.
Kevin
Pittsburgh, PA
March 10th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Hi Mike and Mark,
I’m in the music industry, producing records for Universal Music, Warner Music, etc… and also managing a team of now 12 people.
Statistically, 90% of all people who listen to my music on their iPod or Computer never paid for it. What I’m trying to proof? Nothing. Just letting you know that I’m here and that I appreciate the fact that today, for the first time ever, Mark mentioned the music industry (in the “coaching trinity” podcast). I nearly cried.
As a sidenote, Jack Welch mentions the music industry in his autobiography. I nearly cried, desperately waiting for one of my big management heros to talk about the music industry. My excitement didn’t last long. It was a very short note saying “we didn’t like the culture in the record business, so we sold it” (about selling RCA’s record business to Bertelsmann when GE aquired NBC).
Since I became a premium member, my business grew 2000%. I’ve just coached one of my guys about dealing with high “C”s on the way back from the grocery store.
Sorry for my random note, I’m a high “I”.
Thanks,
Marc Mozart
www.mozartandfriends.com
March 10th, 2008 at 5:54 pm
Hi Mike and Mark,
As stated earlier on the blog and the forum I also love your work on Manager Tools. And I think most of us disaprove taking advantage of someone elses work.
But because you’re bringing up the subject (why we are doing this), I would like to give a comment on that. I’m a listener from the early days of Manager Tools and I remember that one of the first statements in the podcast was that it is a free source of information for people who want to become better managers.
Now don’t get me wrong I have nothing against commercially exploiting your experience. He, it’s worth a million dollars and we all know that. But I am noticing a trend where you more and more keep recommending your premium content. I had a discussion about it with a dear friend of mine and we both chad the opinion that it affects the effectivity of the podcasts.
Please can you do something about it? It would bother me if you would mention the premium subscription in the intro, at the end and somewhere in between. But now I keep hearing the words premium content, or it that only me?
Once again: I don’t mind some advertisement, but I think focus is more on that than on an effective podcast (like we use to have).
March 10th, 2008 at 5:56 pm
“It would bother me if you would mention the premium subscription in the intro, at the end and somewhere in between.” should of course be “It wouldn’t bother me if you would mention the premium subscription in the intro, at the end and somewhere in between.”
March 10th, 2008 at 6:03 pm
Bryan-
Thanks for your support.
Because of your situation (and the hassle of having to get your credit card info to process a refund), we’ve extended your premium subscription for an additional year, until Aug 2009.
We appreciate your support of Manager Tools.
Mark
March 10th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
What you have done with these casts is remarkable, and at the core of that is your willingness to share so much for free.
Hopefully you can now use that platform as a launching pad to make MT a sustainable venture - commercially as well as spiritually.
Clearly you guys have that in your minds, clearly you understand the possible approaches involved, and clearly you’ve decided (for the time being) that you’re willing to be exposed to cheats.
I do hope you’ll eventually find the right balance between pricing, technical restrictions, and free content.
Nb. I think most of your paying listeners would cope with the odd technical hurdle if it keeps them from subsidising freeloaders. After all, if you can’t make the venture sustainable, it’s the rest of us that lose.
Cheers, Chris
March 10th, 2008 at 7:28 pm
Hi Mike and Mark,
I just want to echo some of the above comments. Your work is fantastic and clearly there are literally tens of thousands of people benefitting enormously from what you do every week, week in, week out. I’m glad you’re not letting the actions of a few ‘less honourable’ folk affect your mission, because it’s a mission that’s worthwhile, and a mission that’s working.
I agree with Chris that I would be prepared to jump through a few more hurdles if you had to put in extra security to ‘protect’ manager tools. However, I understand and agree with the reasons you haven’t done that, and I hope it never comes to it.
I have just signed up to Premium Content to express my solidarity
(I had been going to anyway, but this made it seem even more appropriate)
Thank you for all your hard work,
Matt
March 10th, 2008 at 8:01 pm
Hi everyone.
This is the first time I leave some comment, but it’s really necessary to send a big “thank you” to Mike and Mark.
I’m a weekly listener since 2005 and I learn a lot. My problem is that I don’t have time to listen all casts carefully. Normally in my vacations I take some time to listen you talking about.
Thank you.
All the best from Portugal.
L. Alvelos
March 10th, 2008 at 8:43 pm
Thank you all for your wonderful comments.
We are truly grateful for the time you spend with us every week.
It’s a privilege!
Mark
March 10th, 2008 at 10:30 pm
I’m a little uncear about what you mean by the word unsubscribed “admitted to paying for premium content, downloading it all, and then unsubscribing.” and so I’m not quite sure what meaning you are drawing from it.
Do you mean that they paid for premium content, downloaded it all, and then somehow cancelled the payment? If that is the case, then I would understand you (and all of us paying members) feeling a bit cheated.
If you mean that they paid for the premium content, downloaded it all and then unsubscribed in their RSS reader/podcatcher software because they thought it was all crap, then I can see that you would disaapointed that they didn’t find value.
I’m just not sure which one it is. Given your discussion of IP protection I assume it is the first one and I would put it down to the cost of doing business.
March 10th, 2008 at 11:02 pm
Mike & Mark,
I’ll be honest, I’ve been looking around for various other Management type podcasts other than yours….see what’s out there.
I also find myself deleting all of them after one or two casts. The content is either too long and boring or too short with no substance.
On the other hand, I have three feeds for MT. The Premium (Tiffany advice at Wal-Mart prices), The Basic intro casts and the Regular casts. They take a good amount of space but I reference them all the time with the premium content. You guys are producing the product that you said you would. The premium content is WELL WORTH IT. I have seen improvements in my own work and the people around me.
I salute you both…
March 11th, 2008 at 12:30 am
Mark,
Thank you so much for your kind gesture, it is greatly appreciated. I hope you have a wonderful weekend and I cannot wait for the next podcast.
Bryan
California
March 11th, 2008 at 1:13 am
Mark & Mike,
I also want to thank you, not only for the your work, but the way you go about it.
I work for a Christian faith development organization in the Balkans. As best I can tell, management training is non-existent in my “company”. Speaking for NGOs in general, many of us would never be able to pay for the kind of management training you offer for free on a regular basis. I’m so grateful to you because I believe my team runs better, and that we help more people more effectively, because of you guys.
Thank you for all you do.
Jeff
Kosovo
March 11th, 2008 at 4:07 am
Mike and Mark,
I would like to thank you for your generosity and the great work. Giving remarkable advices and providing simple tools all for free is not common. I truly appreciate it.
Your cast made me, and many other, eager to be a better manager. That’s a hell of an accomplishment !
Olivier
March 11th, 2008 at 5:45 am
Mike and Mark,
As I approach one year of my involvement with MT, All I can say is please keep doing great work. I am learning a lot from the MT community.
Just waiting for July 31 to arrive to renew my subscription. I guess that is the least I can do thank you in some way.
Regards
Karthik
Bangalore, India.
March 11th, 2008 at 6:04 am
Hello Mark, hello Mike,
there is one of your sentence which affects me:
“But we’re not going to make it hard for the vast majority of folks to grow and develop because of a few who don’t share our view of honor.”
This is one of the rare times when I see that people don’t take the easy way. Most times all will be punished for things only one or two are responsible for.
Thank you for your reaction to this case. Reading and hearing you give me the hope that there are more people out there who don’t have only there own advantage in mind.
Please go on as you do. It’s great!
Judith
March 11th, 2008 at 11:22 am
Mike and Mark,
As a managing consultant focused on the world of HR and M&A, I have occasionally fallen into “I see no results” trap. For our colleague who laments her “lack” of results, or for others “envious” of those with different skills, take time to think of the series of events that had to occur - with your input, your team’s efforts - in order for your client to achieve results. No chain of events is possible without a team. If you’re effective (read Drucker if you want more), you have an impact by virtue of your effectiveness and leadership.
It has been my great privilege to have know Mark for over a decade. His response to the “download, unsibscribe” reflects his true honor. Thank you Mark, and Mike, for proving that one bad apple doesn’t necessarily ruin the bushel. Your examples and efforts are the backbone of the honor society your building in MT.
March 11th, 2008 at 11:37 am
Count me among those who pay for premium content and seldom use it. I buy it as a sign of support for you guys. I’ll bet you that there’s ten like me for every IP thief.
March 11th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
I’ve strayed far from Mark, Mike and the M-T community in the past year but I am proud premium subscriber. I regularly use the premium content and am pleased to financially help M-T exist and grow.
March 11th, 2008 at 3:14 pm
Mark and Mike
I’d just like to add my voice to those saying thanks for your great work and liberal position.
All my work is done on Linux, both in the office and at home. Having your content available in standards compliant and unencumbered forms is important to me philosophically but even more so technically, since otherwise I’d most likely not be able to use it at all.
Phil
March 11th, 2008 at 9:00 pm
To all-
We are regularly humbled by your support. For those of you who are paying for premium content and not using it, we tip our hats to you.
We look forward to many years of serving you - it’s a privilege every day.
Mark
March 12th, 2008 at 12:44 am
Hi Mark and Mike
Your post on this issue highlights one of the reasons I love Manager Tools. Your ethical standards really raise the bar in terms of what great management should be. It’s great to see those standards put into practice.
I know you know this - because you said as much in a recent cast - but just remember that your podcasts make a difference to the lives of myself, my directs, and my boss on a daily basis (even if the latter two don’t always know it!).
Keep up the great work and see you at the Sydney Conference. I’m pre-wiring the company’s bean counters already
But nothing’s going to keep me away.
Mark
March 12th, 2008 at 7:10 am
Anyone that unsubscribes from premium content NOW means they won’t get the great stuff that’s going to come LATER. It’s their loss!
My Grandmother always told me that you should behave well now, because if you don’t “it will only come back and bite you on the butt later”. She has been proven right time and time again - and this is just another case.
I also believe that ‘allowing’ yourself to be taken advantage of is neccessary in order to achieve the greatest success, and (on balance) benefits will always win out. I know that Mike and Mark, and the rest of the MT community, see this in all the wonderful support that is provided here.
I’ve not yet become a premium subscriber, but will be doing so shortly, and am happy to support Manager Tools by doing so and continuing to spread the word.
Thanks, Mike and Mark, for making Manager Tools what it is.
Tamsin
March 12th, 2008 at 8:11 am
Hi Mark and Mike,
Haven’t written you a “love” note in awhile so thought I’d chime in. I get value from MT every single day. Reading the forums (free) is my daily breakfast ritual. Your guidance and wisdom have created the most amazing online community I’ve ever had the privilege to be part of.
I still wait eagerly every Monday morning for the next podcast, and I listen to nearly every one twice (or more).
I occasionally download the premium content for my reference files. Yesterday, I copied two paragraphs from “peer feedback model” show notes and sent it to a former mentee of mine who reached out because she’s adjusting to the adult world of office politics. Of course I included a note about copyright and a strong urging to join and use MT. This stuff is gold, and I would simply not be able to afford to pay more. Your accessible pricing means that folks like me (a supervisor, not high-paid manager) can learn and grow with the best support in the world.
Finally, your balanced approach to intellectual property rights, your focus on the honour system, reminds of a favourite professor’s view on student cheating. It’s going to happen, of course. But this professor sees her duty as more about service and education, and less about gatekeeping. She wants to devote most of her time and intellectual capacity to those students who want to learn and grow, and she figures the others will get what’s due to them in the end.
In deep appreciation for all you do.
Rachelle
March 12th, 2008 at 8:56 am
Amen, Brothers and Sisters!
My biggest lament is being 60 and not having access to this when I was younger. I watched my dad struggle with management and then go back to being a worker because there was no one to teach him the necessary tools. As I have moved through my career I have looked for those tools to help me. I am glad there is still time for me to use these tools to cap my career with your good stuff.
I have been sharing your interviewing advice with my son and saying things like “remember what Mark and Mike said about….” The nod of recognizing a principle is encouraging. Hopefully, the interviewing process will end shortly.
He has a great story about being offered a job about the time you did your “how to make a job offer cast.” The offer was so pathetic I wondered how the firm stayed in business.
Larry
March 12th, 2008 at 1:26 pm
Mike and Mark,
I am glad that you wrote that note! It reminded me that I needed to up the anty to become a premium member. I have been a registered member and listner for a couple of months now and the value that I have ALREADY gotten out of listening is worth the membership cost and I may NEVER download any of the premium content.
You guys deserve it! You have changed my life as a manager and I really appreciate your insight.
Keep it up!
March 12th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Mark and Mike;
I just wanted to write a quick letter to let you both know how important your work is to people like me. I am a lower-level manager who, after thinking that he knew a lot after getting his MBA has learned that he knew less about the stuff that really matters than he realized.
The service that you both provide is crucial in providing individuals like myself with a source of encouragement and a “family” of friends to share our management ups and downs. I have made several mistakes as a manager, but with you and the community that is MT I have learned from all of them. I have also learned from other’s mistakes as your forum provides a safe environment for the sharing of ideas, these things that are not found in MBA curriculum.
I hope that letters like mine make it worthwhile for you both to continue this. I have come to view everyone in MT as an extended family, some of the few people who have taken an active interest in my skills and growth. You and everyone in MT have no motivations outside of a general, sincere desire to make the world a much better place. I have become a much better manager and a much better person in large part to your efforts and the assistance of the MT family at large. My membership is but a small token of my sincere appreciation for your efforts.
March 12th, 2008 at 10:30 pm
Guys,
I am a corporate and small to medium size organization trainer and must admit that I feel guilty sharing your info when we get to the “methods” section of strategic implementation. I always give a “manager-tools.com” tag line and mention that anyone worth retaining will have these podcasts loaded on their ipod within three days. I give the URL to the beginning page on all hand-outs. Yet, I feel that I should be paying a training license for all the knowledge I’ve gained from your casts.
In marketing we all know that facts tell (features) and stories sell (benefits), so I use my personal experience with the tools when I present the trinity (of four parts?). Now, my standard presentation covers four other key factors, with methods being one fifth, so my guilt is not too consuming.
Do you want to hear the strangest objection you’ve probably ever encountered?
I don’t want to buy the premium content because I would be more likely to use it in my paid presentations. Who uses cognitive dissonance as an objection? Help me assuage these fears. Are licensed trainers part of your business model?
Love everything you do! I’ve been listening now since October of 06, and look forward to seeing you guys as superstars of management (like Collins, Drucker, Hershey). Bring a meeting to Florida.
Shawn Frost
MBA
http://PositionedToSucceed.com
March 13th, 2008 at 9:04 am
Shawn-
Why don’t we chat by email? The license for our work is only for individual use, but I’m just not clear how you’re using our works.
Please send us a note at showAT.
Thanks!
Mark
March 13th, 2008 at 9:25 am
Mark, your post was very touching. And I hope that the person that took advantage of yours and Mike’s kindness is reading this and feels really bad for a long time. Thank you for not putting the screws to the rest of us. I’m a premium subscriber, and the first week, I went nuts downloading, then work caught up with me and I’m not up to date, but I paid in full for the year, so I know where it is at. I have found the podcasts and the materials in valuable, helping me in my quest to be better at what I do. Another manager at my work is also listening and applying MT and we get together and share the successes and problems that we encounter as we try to implement MT.
We will both be traveling to Chicago in less than 2 weeks to the conference. We can hardly wait.
JoeM
March 13th, 2008 at 9:44 am
Hi guys–
You provide amazing content. And give most of it away for free! You are a blessing.
Here’s my dilemma: I am a monthly subscriber with a new baby and a tight household budget. The tightness is partly voluntary; it sounds almost crazy in today’s culture, but my husband and I have decided to pay off ALL our debt in 5 years, including the house.
This aggressive approach requires us to put a name on every dollar every month and to make sure that the expense meets our family’s needs. Therefore, even the tiny amount I send you must be questioned, reviewed and approved by us as we create our spending plan.
Other listeners/premium subscribers may find themselves in a similar budget situation, whether voluntarily or not. They subscribed in good faith but need to cancel for their own reasons.
So, if needed, at what point can I unsubscribe and not be unethical? I want to pay a fair price for your product, but *I* can’t set that price. I will always end up paying more than the “right” price (the “right” price makes me feel I got more than I paid for so that I perceive the purchase to be a good value). It’s just the psychology of buying and selling – nothing new.
If I intentionally pay only $15, use the RSS feed to dump all the content onto my laptop, and then walk, I know I have gotten a lot more than I have paid for. So much more that it seems too good to be ethical. I *feel* like a cheater. But I paid what you asked and you set up the feed to allow a 60-sec download of all the content to my laptop. You offered me a buffet, provided a catering truck to take it all home in, and then charged me based on my time in the restaurant. When can I leave the restaurant and not be a dishonorable, cheating thief?
Somewhere between $15 and $165 is a threshold – if I unsubscribe below that threshold, I have done something wrong. I have violated the honor system. But I don’t know where that threshold is – you haven’t told me because you haven’t set a price for “the Premium collection as it currently stands”.
Therefore, would you consider creating a “grab and go” price for those of us who care about being ethical but can’t justify an ongoing expense or the full year subscription? I can then evaluate your price and your product and determine if I think it is a good deal. People who intentionally want to cheat can still do so; people who want to go month to month can still do so. But those of us who love you, who love your work, and who want to be good people can pay once and be done with it.
Alternately, can you publish a book & workbook that I can buy that contains the tools and lessons from the cast? This has the added benefit of being lendable.
Thank you again for all you have done and all that you do. I really do need an answer, even if you can’t give one – I have so far paid out of my “personal allowance” but I have a 1st birthday and a wedding anniversary coming up that I want to buy gifts for, so this subscription fee is out on the chopping block. I just don’t want to feel guilty that my $45 was not enough each time I reach for your PowerPoints.
Anne Wells
March 13th, 2008 at 9:35 pm
I figured out the source of my confusion. I subscribed for 12 months, and forgot that you can actually just subscribe month by month.
So someone subscribed for one month, downloaded all the content, and then unsubscribed, thereby getting all past premium content for $15? This appears to be completely in line with the terms of the premium subscription, so I really don’t see that anyone should feel guilty for doing so. You make 2 poins very clearly on the subscruption page. 1. You get access to all past material; and 2. you can unsubscribe any time you want to.
Now maybe it would make more sense to have a minimum initial subscription or something like that, but given that is the offer you put out there you should assume that some people will do the logical thing and decide to pay the minimum price for the content. Arguments about it not being in the “spirit” of the offer seem a bit strange. If you offer a product on commercial terms it seems rather naive to think that customers won’t take maximum advantage of those terms.
I personally would not like to see a situation where premium content can only be used whilst the subscription is maintained.
March 14th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Mark and Mike,
Thanks for your work.
More importantly, thanks for your hearts and a willingness to be true servants.
-Jim+
March 14th, 2008 at 7:21 pm
Thank you
March 14th, 2008 at 8:03 pm
tomas,
I suppose we could construct a a commercial contract to avoid the situation … frankly, I’d just as soon rely on honor and judgment.
I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree here.
All the best,
Mike
March 14th, 2008 at 8:42 pm
Tomas-
Your post saddens me. I wouldn’t want managers working for me who see things the way you see this situation.
Mark
March 14th, 2008 at 9:40 pm
Mark and Mike,
I have been silent in the forums up to this point. I discovered you guys on iTunes last summer and have literally immersed myself in your content for the last 8 months. The three of us go everywhere in my truck. My daughters (9 and 15) know what the Trinity is and even how to leave a voicemail. And my directs are learning “The Way” and we are truly starting to see a transformation in our 125 person company.
Know this. Your work is not the so-called cutting edge frill that constitutes mainstream business advice/theory, but rather the “blocking and tacking” how-to advice we’ve all been looking for.
Your business model deserves just compensation. I hope the MT conferences are finally starting to pay back dividends worthy of your contributions to the business world at large. Perhaps you will expand it some day to (licensed) MT protégé’s around the globe that spread the message a la Dale Carnegie.
Keep focusing on the execution and the “How-to”, make it concise and to the point. The vast majority of your audience “gets it” once we listen to a cast a few times and study the supporting materials. Your work is transforming companies around the globe.
I’m in to the point that I’m willing to leave the warm climate of the Caribbean to join you in chilly Chicago for the upcoming conference. And I can truly say I’ve never been more excited to attend a conference. My directs know that I’ll be attending and have given me homework above and that which I have assigned myself.
Keep the Faith and Best Regards,
Stuart Logan
March 14th, 2008 at 10:32 pm
Stuart-
Thanks for sharing how Manager Tools is helping you and your directs and your family. I look forward to meeting you and answering all of your questions.
It’s a privilege to serve you.
Mark
March 14th, 2008 at 11:38 pm
Gents,
Wanted to say thanks for sharing Manager Tools with us all. I’d been managing the western region (a region I was a big part of building from scratch) for my firm for the last few years and recently was asked to step down from that role and take over our east region as it was struggling. Very different situation. I realize now I had the luxury of just administering my staff in the west. I had lucked out to be succinct. After taking over the east region I quickly realized I needed to rethink my approach. This was a staff of lots of potential but had severely lacked coaching and mentorship for the last several years. I stumbled across Manager Tools and have been a huge fan of the results since. I’m sold and thanks for your help!
March 15th, 2008 at 11:44 am
Hello, just a quick note to say thank you for making me more successful and a tip to professionals out there that it is worth to pay for the membership and easy to get reimbursed for your annual subscription if you explain to your boss how beneficial it can be for you. It worked for me and I have been enjoying the premium content and been striving for premium results!
Excellent work, keep it up!
March 15th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Mark & Mike,
BLUF: Forget about the thieves and focus on us. They’re not your target audience - we are. And as “toolies” we understand the value of what you teach. Therefore we’re willing to pay for it.
Your body of work has been a godsend to me. I’m a young manager in a tech company that doesn’t understand management or leadership very well. So there’s nobody to mentor me on how to lead.
I can’t speak for the losers that pay $15 for your work and then walk away to plagiarize it. I guess if I were in your place I wouldn’t stress over them - they’re not your target audience. Focusing on the negative aspect (theft of IP) will bring you down and lower your drive to do this. Focus on me - the 32-year-old in an organization that doesn’t spend much money on employee development and doesn’t have a mentorship program (mentorship, strategy, coaching). Focus on the girl that just got promoted to Director and now manages managers for the first time (what’s a skip level?) Focus on the first line supervisor that just watched his counterpart get off and now he’s responsible for 13+ direct reports (time management? O3s?)
I’m a premium subscriber for life. I’ve listened to every podcast and read every PDF. I have the Horstman’s Laws posted in my office at work. I cite your work in my school projects (studying for my MBA). I’m a toolie. I’m part of your audience. And I’m not an IP thief. So use my money to make me a better manager - and create better managers for me to leverage when I move onward and/or upward.
Keep up the great work - and keep your spirits up!
-tom
March 15th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
Tom,
You rock … and, of course, you’re absolutely right. Thanks!
Mike
March 15th, 2008 at 8:45 pm
Hey Mark and Mike,
I understand your frustration on the people that fall in the “Well what if we do a monthly subscription and someone takes all the content and leaves?”. It happens. But I guarantee you this or any individual that has that type of respect to do that will not succeed as a manager. He may believe that they have all the tools that you guys created and he can use them to his advantage but he won’t because management is not only on technique and instruction books, it’s on attitude, integrity and respect not only inside work but outside of work. Down to your family, your friends, to strangers and to the directs.
People who take your content and run away with it don’t have the attitude to play to win.
No amount of knowledge will save or enhance an unrespectable manager.
Focus on those that truly want to succeed and enhance not only their management career but their personal life by upholding their integrity and values and playing to win.
Jorrian Gelink - Alberta Canada
March 15th, 2008 at 10:55 pm
Thanks Jorrian!
Mark
March 17th, 2008 at 12:37 am
Sorry to be dense, but could someone please connect the dots for me?
“[W]e got our first confessional email from a member who admitted to paying for premium content, downloading it all, and then unsubscribing”, followed by talk about IP thievery, which I inferred means this guy.
If he paid for the IP, where’s the stealing part? Or does unsubscribing quickly give him a refund?
Btw, I’m a big fan, recommending you guys far & wide. Haven’t bought any of the premium stuff [yet!], but am loving the rest of it — thanks!
March 17th, 2008 at 4:29 am
M&M,
Tom is so to the point - enough said, add only that the bad weed will be cleared by the rest of us, no need to worry.
“Us” are the folks that wouldn’t dream of stealing something that we appreciate beyond what I think we realize.
Thanks guys. YOU also rock!
Bjorn
March 17th, 2008 at 4:30 am
I think I have to leave a comment on this thread, because I am the person Mark was talking about in his post. I downloaded the contents and then unregistered.
I’d like to explain here why, as I explained to Mark and Mike in my email.
I am currently a management student, and I just can’t afford to subscribe continually at this time, all the more because I’m spending one year doing voluntary work.
My email to Mark and Mike had a few goals:
- first: thank them for the GREAT job they’re doing in MT: They already made me much more effective;
- second: to thank them again to allow broke students to download the materials;
- third: to commit to subscribe again as soon as I get a job.
Although some will certainly look at me with contempt, I think it was more honest to sincerely thank them.
March 17th, 2008 at 11:17 am
A nod and a bow to ggdpower for his candor.
We will be providing him his first year of premium content at no charge.
It’s never been about the money, folks - it’s about the principle of management as an ethical profession.
If you feel yourself doing something about which you will later feel the need to confess, that’s a sign you ought not.
Mark
March 17th, 2008 at 4:46 pm
Who is the guy you talked about?
I hope he will put everything on bittorrent soon enough!
March 17th, 2008 at 5:41 pm
Dear Mark and Mike,
I am happy to hear that you are sticking to your plan - and I hope all these endorsements have encouraged you even more…
With you guys in my headphones, I have grown as a manager and professional the last 2 years. Adopting the manager tools as prescribed has given me great results. It seems so easy and common sense – but doing it (and sticking to it) one step at a time makes the big difference. For me and my directs.
For that I owe you,
Thanks!
March 17th, 2008 at 7:34 pm
Arthurtest-
Help me understand your comment. Are you in favor of ggdpower sharing our work freely, in violation of the agreement?
Mark
March 17th, 2008 at 7:34 pm
Andersbirch-
Thanks for your comments!
Mark
March 17th, 2008 at 9:31 pm
Mike, Mark,
As a Software Procurement Manager for a major financial institution in Australia I deal with Intellectual Property Rights as part of my job.
What I have learnt over the last 18 months is that it doesn’t matter what you try to do to protect you IPR someone will do something stupid and think they have certain rights to use/reuse other entities IPR. I have couselled numerous people over this and the need to seek advice before using IPR of others. Our contracts and agreements are specific about IPR and who owns what, when and how much.
Both Suppliers and our own staff “inadvertantly” appropriate IP that is not theirs and place them and their organisation at great risk.
Your collective works are an enormous benefit to me and I would not hesitate in reporting any breach of IPR to the appropriate organisations. It is both right and ethical to do so.
Stephen
March 18th, 2008 at 1:15 am
Arthurtest :
I think you misunderstood me: there is no way I am redistributing Mark and Mike’s work in violation of the license agreement.
I respect their work and have acknowledged how valuable it is. I still do and advise Manager Tools to any person who comes to me saying “how come you’re young and know how to run a meeting? Took me ages to get there”.
And it happens. Sure, I’m not senior enough to have been in position to have O3s, and as a few commentators mentioned, it’s likely I’m not getting of MT as much as they do (I’m sure experience helps).
But starting with good basics is really good for me and I’m sure M&M made a good economic choice when they chose not to set a legal barrier with a one year engagement, because as soon as I get a job, I’m registering long term.
March 18th, 2008 at 1:00 pm
GGDpower and smholland-
Thank you both for your points of view. ggd - I continue to be impressed. I hesitated sharing your story, and only did so because no one would know who….and we have plenty of “IP” stories we could share.
I’m impressed. Glad you’re here.
Mark
March 18th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
Mark and Mike
To further my development as a manager and to express my gratitude to the two of you I enrolled in premium content today.
March 18th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
Thank you sir! We believe you will get more value than you paid.
It’s a privilege to serve you.
Mark
March 18th, 2008 at 10:38 pm
I am the one who should be thanking you (the royal you) your casts make my role to manage upwards (I have no directs) that much easier. Your basic support services fee is incredible value for money. I have signed up for premium content on Monday, to provide a small recompense for the value I receive from your collective works.
March 20th, 2008 at 8:21 pm
Mark, I’m pretty sure that Arthurtest was being sarcastic. God…I hope so at least!
March 28th, 2008 at 3:19 am
Hi there,
Just read your comment about ‘hit and run’ on premium content.
Maybe I’m the guilty one, but it is a bit confusing. I signed up to Premium content, specifically to get the interview series, only to find it wasn’t part of the price. So then I signed up to the Interview series and down loaded that (eventually, you may recall the problem I had downloading here in South Africa - by the way, I didn’t get the job).
I cancelled the premium content subscription. Whilst I would like (some of) it, it is just too expensive on a monthly basis here in South Africa.
Am I sacked?
All the best my friends,
Richard
March 28th, 2008 at 8:47 am
Hi Mike and Mark,
I have to get back on a comment given earlier on this post. I must apologies for the statements made about advertising during your podcasts.
I guess that I wasn’t up-to-date with listening to your podcasts, because when I listened to the latest casts this week I noticed less comments on premium subscribtions and conferences during the podcast.
I’m sorry for my previous comment. Keep up the good work.
Kind regards,
Dennis
March 28th, 2008 at 9:48 pm
Anne-
I’m sorry I missed the part about you ‘needing’ an answer!
Here’s our answer: that’s for you to decide. Since this is all about how YOU will feel, it seems inappropriate for us to set that price. If you want, unsub after one month. I would suspect you would feel like you were cheating.
I’m not sure it’s relevant, but if it helps, we feel good every month. We deliver FAR more than $15 worth of value every month - and we know it because individual coaching clients have paid us $7500 for just one of the ideas in one of our casts. And, you have to draw your own conclusions whether or not YOU feel that OUR offering justifies OUR feelings. Maybe you agree, maybe you don’t. We priced our service where we did so we would never doubt it.
From that perspective then - not that it’s the only one (and we generally find ‘fairness’ to be a poorly understood concept) - you will have to decide when YOU feel that YOU have paid enough for the value YOU have received.
Yes, our system introduces a gray area, and this post indicates that someone took advantage of it. It is most certainly nearly always the gray areas that introduce ethical decision-making. We reserve the right to disagree with folks who would set the bar too low. That’s why we’ve set our bar so high - so that we doubt anyone would disagree with us.
All ethical decision making carries risk.
We trust you.
Your call.
Mark
March 28th, 2008 at 9:49 pm
Dennis-
No worries. Thanks for the note.
Mark
March 28th, 2008 at 9:59 pm
Folks-
A good discussion.
I’ll respond more fully in a blog post (not comment).
Mark
March 29th, 2008 at 3:00 am
Sorry to drag this out, but one suggestion (which I’m sure you’ve considered) would to charge per item purchased (as when buying music from iTunes). You could even have prices for a single song (sorry, I mean podcast backing papers) and a discounted price for a whole album, I mean CD, I mean series of podcasts.
Keep up the good work.
Just responded to your user survey with a few other suggestions, but nothing new to you I’m sure.
South Africa beckons you!
Richard
March 29th, 2008 at 10:32 am
Richard -
Thanks, but that makes it a lot harder for us and for all those who are approaching this honorably.
All pricing decisions have inherent risks, and what we’re talking about in this thread is one of our ours.
Thanks for your help on the survey!
Mark
March 30th, 2008 at 8:35 pm
Just had to comment here, GGDpower, maybe I am being a little thick (it is nearly 01:15 here!!) but if you wanted the premium content at discount etc why didn’t you just explain your situation first to Mike and Mark? I have been in email contact with Mike recently and although I never asked him for anything, just explained what a fantastic job they were doing especially for people who cant afford to pay for training he gave me a years subscription for nothing, just like you have now. These guys are honorable people, they deserve the respect and honor of all of us, not having enough money does not constitute an excuse for what amounts to theft, I have been listening to Mike and Mark from nearly the beginning and have never considered doing what you did, maybe you should try to think ethically. I apologise if this seems acerbic, but Mike has helped me and one thing is certain, as soon as I can afford the subscription fee I WILL pay it and I will also ensure that anyone else within my organisation who would benefit will do the same because I will put the tools to good use, help make my organisation prosper and as such pay for all the managers to have the content.
Mike-thanks you’re a star
Mark-you’re not so bad either!! Even the Dark Mark!!! LOL
Very Best Regards to you both and all the other MT devotees.
Adam.
March 31st, 2008 at 10:53 am
Adam-
Thank you.
Mark
May 17th, 2008 at 11:45 am
Mark-
I would not worry to much about your material being stolen and then used for making money.
You cannot steal enthousiasm
You cannot steal honesty
You cannot steal motivation
You cannot steal friendship
You cannot steal the community feeling
Yes, Manager Tools are based tools, but without the motivation to use them, they just will not work. They would be dead material.
Cédric.