How to Give Feedback About Attire
March 30th, 2008This cast describes how to give feedback about your employees’ attire.
Mark once was asked to adjudicate a discussion between two managers (one new, one experienced). The issue? “Should a manager give feedback about the clothes an employee is wearing?”
Mark sided with the manager who said no, you shouldn’t.
If you’re surprised, listen in!
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March 30th, 2008 at 6:23 pm
What do you suggest TO wear, for men, for those of us who don’t shop at Brooks Brothers?
Are nice cordoury pants OK?
Thanks for the great cast as usual. I feedback for female employees was especially useful.
March 31st, 2008 at 11:31 am
JonP-
We have a cast coming up about that, but nice cords can be okay, in some jobs in some industries
Mark
March 31st, 2008 at 12:41 pm
Very timely cast as spring is near. This was one topic I didn’t make the connection to behavior, i.e. a choice the emmployee is making. As usual, the feedback examples were spot on.
Thanks for another timely and relevant cast.
Jim
March 31st, 2008 at 4:58 pm
Jim-
I wondered if anyone was going to figure that out. 99% of our casts have no special relevance to a time of year, but this one did.
Mark
April 1st, 2008 at 7:23 am
Excellent cast. Fit the “classic MT formula:” a very practical approach to a thorny day-to-day challenge, with an attention-grabber in the beginning and some seemingly causal banter keeping it moving along through clearly outlined steps. A textbook application of your brand.
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:45 am
Great cast! It also worked well as a review of the importance of focusing on behaviors.
I also now better appreciate how lucky I am that all but one of my staff wear a uniform. We get to discuss grooming standards instead of poor clothing choices.
Jeff
April 5th, 2008 at 7:03 am
Very, very interesting cast, although I am still hesitant about how I would apply it.
I’m no manager but I have noticed something very interesting in my workplace. Once a year we have a Xmas dinner which is quite formal: no cocktail but a sitting-down dinner with about 300 people attending. It is almost like a wedding. The first time I attended (and because I have heard previously your cast about Xmas parties) I changed into a suit even though, because the dinner is held on Fridays, I came to work casual (chinos). I thought more or less everybody would do the same: suits for the guys, maybe some “formal” skirts or business jackets for the ladies.
I was stunned. My female colleagues came dressed to the nines: out were the glasses, in the contact lenses, where there was some curly hair came a full saloon treatment, lots of cocktail or night dresses. It was almost as a New Year’s Eve party. It was a feast for my eyes, but I came out with the sensation that it was a little bit over the top for being what it really was, a professional environment.
Anyway, the thing that stunned me the most is that SOME of those same female colleagues that took special care that night come much less formal to the workplace: no hairdos, no contact lenses, no business suits or smart skirts. NO, I’m not asking for night gowns or cleavages of course, but my opinion is that a professional suit, EVEN if you are not meeting clients that day, or some smart dress choices, REALLY help your career.
Before everybody starts screaming sexist let me explain: what I mean is that if you look PROFESSIONAL you would have another bonus when people (bosses AND peers) asses your performance. If I am a good analyst but I come to work without a good shaving, or my hair a little mess up, or a suit that is screaming for a good ironing, doesn’t it reduce my overall impact?
SOME of those female colleagues say that because they wake up so early (0600-0630) and we have to be on time every morning (the stock market does not wait for abybody), it is a burden to do your hair properly and they prefer to come to work with some comfortable clothes (if they are not meeting a client) but I still feel you could go the extra mile from time to time. I might not have to do my hair every morning but I surely have to shave!
Anyway, hope I have explained myself without sounding sexist (far from it, I want my female colleagues to succeed in their careers). I am not meaning they come to work with jeans or some other inappropiate attire, but (at least in my view) their dress choices (chinos, for example) do not look as professional as the suits that we wear.
What do you think? Let me know!
Javier
April 5th, 2008 at 10:28 pm
Javier,
Yes, you’re being sexist (and I’m not screaming, just talking). You can be sexist while still wishing the women in your office success. You are exhibiting “attitudes, conditions, or behaviors that promote stereotyping of social roles based on gender.” [American Heritage Dictionary]
For example:
Wearing glasses is not unprofessional. There are undoubtedly men in your office wearing glasses. Why hold only women to that standard?
Hair should be neat and clean, of course, but why should only women be responsible for creating “hairdos” every morning?
“I was stunned…. It was a feast for my eyes…” Words reveal thoughts. Discretion is a professional skill well worth developing.
John
April 5th, 2008 at 10:38 pm
I can see both your points. Javier - beware of the vocabulary police. John, I think a case could be made, but it’s not a slam dunk.
And this cast was not about men and women.
Mark
April 6th, 2008 at 8:37 am
Mark,
I can see your point.
John
April 6th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
John
No problem, I wanted the debate.
I understand your comments. The issue I was trying to raise was: if SOME of my female colleagues are not that “image conscious” on a daily basis (again, when not meeting clients), why going so over the top for a Xmas dinner?
My only objection to your comments is: I reread my comments and I could not find any stereotype promotion. Did I say that female colleagues should look great or nice? No, I said I thought they should look professional at all times, SAME standard I hold for men.
My first point: you should not take for granted (both as a woman OR as a man) that your colleagues are going to judge you just for your work. I think you should also project a professional image even when clients are not around, so to speak.
My second point: other female colleagues DO go the extra mile (when compared to the others) in terms of wardrobe and image choices, and they do project a more professional image. I understand it might sound unfair, but I think is undeniable that image (and I do mean looking business-minded and attentive to detail, not like a bombshell) does help in your career. I can bring up Mike’s anecdote about the guy showing up for an waiter interview wearing a suit. After chuckling a little bit, his second thought was “We have to hire THAT guy”.
One more thing, when I mentioned hairdos (sorry for my poor command of English) I meant showing up with your hair somewhat tidy, not with a hairdresser’s job done. Hair should be neat and clean as you day John, and that implies combing it, sometimes having to spend less than 5 minutes with a hairdryer.
Again, your comments are more than welcomed.
Cheers
Javier
P.S: John, far from my intention to imply that glasses are unprofessional. No, what I meant is that, if you bring them to work everyday, why leaving them at home for a professional setting? When she does that she makes a distinction between both situations, and as I said, I do not think there is.
April 6th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
One more thing (and sorry for being a pain in the neck):
I could also make some comments about my male colleagues regarding poor wardrobe choices.
I focused on SOME of my female colleagues because the difference between their daily appearance and the Xmas dinner was astounding (I am not exaggerating when I say that in some cases, I could not recognize some of them from a distance in the first seconds).
Javier
April 7th, 2008 at 8:17 am
Javier,
It’s about choices people make, relative to the standard. The “standard” can be vague and unwritten, it is often an outgrowth of company culture, and it can change.
The standards for a formal holiday party, for example, are different from the daily office standards. In some firms, the difference in standards (between party and work) is large, and in others, small. They may both be professional settings, but they are not subject to the same rules (dress, drinking, loud music, etc)
The standards for women are different from those for men, especially at parties.
Standards also vary firm to firm. Of course you don’t wear a tie on a shop floor where lathes are operating, but you do at a bank. Even among banks, there is variation. Lazard-Freres has a different standard from Commerce Bank.
I agree that you will be judged on more than your work product. How you dress, how loud you are, what you say…
When you single out any group (women, Catholics, Chinese-Americans…) and focus on their attire, you can be seen as (sexist, intolerant, racist…). Even if those differences truly exist, categorizing based on them will be seen as poor judgement on your part. You may not be a sexist, but your words can (and will) be interpreted as such.
John
April 12th, 2008 at 3:05 am
Awesome topic, due to the fact I am in retail and there is a standard uniform this cast helped me more than I expected, highly effective and have already taught it out to the rest of the management team
(I should get them to make the time to listen to the podcasts).
Surprising me every podcast, thanks guys!
Jorrian Gelink
April 30th, 2008 at 9:54 pm
I work in a creative field (media) where there are a whole different set of judgments about attire, like how edgy, cool and trendy you look, and that comes with its own set of challenges. Mike and Mark, I’m devoted to the ‘casts but sometimes I wish there was more guidance on how to apply the tools to managing creative people. Especially when it comes to giving feedback about the creative output of my team, it’s hard to apply the feedback model. Maybe a future ‘cast?
Keep ‘em comin’!
Miss Pan
May 15th, 2008 at 3:30 am
child whole life insurance…
raves Ophiuchus probably aerials?invites …